Oaten
What a bloody disgrace. Does this kind of thing really still sell newspapers? In the 21st century? Are people really that lacking in their own lives? What the hell has this got to do with anyone except Oaten and his family (including two daughters who have to go to school tomorrow)? What Oaten did was wrong, yes. But within the confines of his marriage. To say he’s been politically naive is an understatement but that’s not a hanging offence yet either.
It seems Oaten has enough problems without the moral adjudicators of a Murdoch newspaper stirring the pot. I suppose, however, we should credit the editor of the News of the World with not patronising his readers. He must, after all, be just about the only person in the country to think that his readers would know who Mark Oaten is. I bet most of them picked up the paper this morning and thought little Mark from Take That had been outed. And then turned to see what Sven’s been up to this week.
And like Nosemonkey says, it’s the use of language that sickens as well. “Rent boy”. The rest of the media dutifully fell into line. I suppose “male prostitute” was considered too politically correct as well as failing to add the strong dash of tawdry prurience that this story demands. It didn’t conjure up the right amount of homophobic revulsion.
None other than Guido Fawkes himself is claiming Oaten’s corpse. He says he outed Oaten in a drunken podcast that made its way as far as that august journal of public morality, Popbitch. He also gives some self-serving, arse-covering excuse about Oaten having been hypocritical over the Government’s plans for prostitution. If this is the kind of thing bloggers need to do to get noticed then I for one want no part of it. And if this turns out to be the first stripe British bloggers earn (“British bloggers claim first scalp”), it will have been scrawled with a turd.
UPDATE: Tim Ireland has a partial transcript of Guido Fawkes’ and Recess Monkey’s podcast. You can make up your own mind but I think reveals them as sniggering little homophobes who like to conflate homosexuality with paedophilia. I’m prepared to be put right on that naturally.
Both of them have left comments on this post attempting to explain themselves.
UPDATE: So there we have it. I’ve heard the famous podcast.
Once you get past the fact it sounds like two O-level Politics students having their first pint (ie, it’s sweary rubbish available on a myriad of blogs, including this one), the stuff about Oaten is, as Tim Ireland says, cracks about Oaten looking like a paedophile tempered with innuendo about Simon Hughes’ sexuality (he’s got a friend called Dorothy, apparently). All very childish, all very grotty but, in the end, it was The Screws wot done it. As Guido says in the comments below, a new podcast is out on Wednesday. I’ll leave to you to decide why he’d see the need to jump on the NOTW’s coat-tails.
…
Max Hastings: It’s simpler to damn a man for his sexual lapses than for his policies
[I]nstead of discussing where the Lib Dems propose to position themselves in British politics – a really interesting question – we can expect days of debate about the merits of three-in-a-bed. The British media have a poor record of uncovering misgovernment, mismanagement and financial chicanery in high places. We lead the world only in exposing bonkers.
The Last Word (for now): That Oaten has been a fool seems indisputable – he built the prison he now sits in. Support for Oaten was conspicuous by its absence from his parliamentary colleagues today. Not even Lembit Opik, who had backed Oaten for the leadership and had been admirably fire and brimstone in his defence of Charles Kennedy, could muster words of any warmth. Every time something like this happens, you think that, for the sake of friendship or camaraderie or empathy or whatever, a colleague will speak out in support, at least acknowledge the dark place in which their friends find themselves, take the risk for pity’s sake. But no, it never happens. Oaten is now unclean and those with ruthless ambitions must get far away for fear of drawing the taint towards them. It’s a dirty world.
Posted on January 22nd, 2006 at 5:10pm under Liberal Democrats, UK politics
| Related posts... • Off the artistic roll call • Brave new world • Meanwhile elsewhere… |
• Permalink • Trackback • Subscribe |
|
|
|
• 36 Comments |
I have to say, I agree. Oaten’s indiscretions pale into insignificance when compared with the relish of the gutter press as they take the undeserved high moral ground.
“And if this turns out to be the first stripe British bloggers earn (“British bloggers claim first scalp”), it will have been drawn with a turd.”
There was Dilpazier Aslam as well, which — although those responsible love to think that they took a scalp — seemed more like a petty witchhunt.
I agree, Justin. Oaten has been foolish but the real story is gutter journalism (no surprise from that particular source) and sadly gutter blogging. Compared to them Oaten’s failings are indeed insignificant.
I am sure that anyone will feel for Mark Oaten’s family incluing his young daughters who have been sacrificed for the egos of Guido and the pervs running the News of the World.
Sick is a weak word to describe it.
Wasn’t it great when they got Aslam? A trainee journalist. Amazing. Me and my mates talked about nothing else for months.
The expression ‘gutter press’ was coined for a reason. So ‘gutter blogging’ is no suprise.
My sympathy goes to his family, but my sympathy for Oaten himself is muted by the fact that he stood for leader with this waiting to explode.
As for Aslam, come on. He was undeclared HuT member. It was the equivelent of outing a BNP member working for the Mail.
I said as much on my blog, but I received the following reply:
—BEGIN QUOTE—
“and why should he resign?�
Because he’s a hypocrite who made political capital out of being a family man and who previously denounced a judge who’d been caught using prostitutes. —END QUOTE—
Aside from the disgusting journalism, James’ comment seems reasonable…
It was Guido wot dun it? Behave.
Bet you anything the NoW have been sitting on this for *ages*, and since their chance of making it a *major* story (say, week before a General Election) has just gone away, they decided to use it while it still had a tiny bit of currency.
martinb: Especially since that, according to the ’story’, the last time the prostitute in question saw Mark Oaten was in February 2005. I think you’ve hit the mark there.
Yes, I suspect it’s more on the lines of ‘it was Guido who got told about the story by someone at the NOTW’ rather than the other way around.
MartinB & Nick,
For the record: the podcast alluded to Oaten’s proclivities at a point where the libel laws were a concern.
Popbitch then mentioned the podcast.
Popbitch then sent out an email referring to scatalogical affairs.
The Screws then ran its story.
As for all the high-minded odure, if you don’t like the blog don’t read it. It says clearly on the banner it is about gossip, rumours and tittle-tattle. Reporting politics with a sense of humour and like its a bloodsport. The blog treats politicians as the enemy class.
It seems to be popular, how many of you have six-figure readerships per month?
Its noticeable that most of the criticism is coming from bloggers with 7 readers bored with their pseudo-Indy editorial style.
NEXT Podcast Wednesday. Bet you subscribe.
It seems to be popular, how many of you have six-figure readerships per month?
Ha! Hey Guido, never mind the quality, feel the width, eh? Is mummy proud?
Even advertising your podcast on blogs with 7 readers? My, you must be desperate.
ChickYog,
I actually wouldn’t include you in the 7-readers-wannabe-an-Indy-leader-writer category. You’re far too good for that, but all these tedious high falutin’, high brow bores are not for me.
In the gutter, getting his hands dirty, with the politicians, that’s Guido.
That is the raison d’etre of the blog – to follow the money, hypocrisy and dishonesty of those who want to be our masters in an amusing accessable populist tabloid fashion.
The whole lobby keeping secrets thing undermines democracy. A pox a the lot of them.
You points your browser, you makes your choice…
P.S. Recess Monkey seems to be getting no credit for his part.
Gavin, that does shade things of course. I hope though you’ll agree when I say I’m not sure an old fashioned 1970s outing with all the attendant prurient homophobia we’re now seeing was a proportionate punishment.
Don, we’ll probably have to agree to disagree on whether Aslam deserved the sack. I was more amused about the huge fuss that was made at the time. Trent Lott he wasn’t.
Gavin: I’d need to see the text of Oaten’s supposed denunciation of the judge before I made an, er, judgement. Ref. please?
Guido:
how many of you have six-figure readerships per month?
Put your cock away, Guido. Plenty of us write for outlets that get more readers than that in a day. So fucking what? Your self-fellatio dressed up as self-justification is funny. Here’s an idea: why not try following the money, hypocrisy and dishonesty of those who want to be our masters instead of raking through the bins?
Guido: recess monkey isn’t boasting.
Oh scratch that.
He is. Cunt.
Ah Guido, we are all in the gutter, but some of us are looking at Mark Oaten’s arse.
Nice class of commenter you get at your place too. You could power a medium-sized fundamentalist religion with the amount of homophobia sloshing around there at the minute.
Put your cock away, Guido. Plenty of us write for outlets that get more readers than that in a day. So fucking what? Your self-fellatio dressed up as self-justification is funny. Here’s an idea: why not try following the money, hypocrisy and dishonesty of those who want to be our masters instead of raking through the bins?
He won’t do that. Don’t know if you have noticed but Sir Guido veers to the right of the political spectrum, although this escapade shows that he also veers to its sewer.
If you’re going to have a go, ask yourself why Oaten resigned from the front bench – not because he was gay – but because he needed to go sort his marriage having shat on his wife and kids.
Don’t forget how much he has used his family in the past, presenting himself as a family man both in elections and the leadership election.
The sad thing is that he sees this gayness (gaiety?) as an “error of judgement” rather than a simple preference for c*ck – a denial which I happen to think is more homophobic than anything of which you may accuse me.
He has reinforced the false idea that you have to be straight, white, married, male and fertile to get anywhere in politics and done a disservice to anyone who doesn’t match these criteria.
Recess Monkey
*indignant*
NB. I’m not suggesting he has deliberatley chosen to portray himself as white, male and fertile.
http://www.recessmonkey.com
recessmonkey@gmail.com
Recess Monkey: It could easily have been described as an error of judgement had he had an affair with a woman. Or am I wrong?
I’m with Justin on this.
Ah Guido, we are all in the gutter, but some of us are looking at Mark Oaten’s arse.
Oscar Wilde’s orginal (which Justin so abling parodied) pointed out that some of us are looking at the stars. We’re dreamers and idealists, hoping and (to a greater or lesser degree) working for a better future. None of us are perfect, we all have indiscretions and/or skeletons in our cupboards. How are we ever going to get the right people to govern if this is the sort of villification and public savaging they can expect.
We complain of the arrogance of our elected representatives, but only arrogant people would risk such exposure. Those of a more considerate nature would run a mile rather than risk such exposure of their actions, regardless of relevance to public office.
Recess Monkey – no, the error of judgement was probably the paying for it bit that you and that Nice Mr Fawkes have pointed out was a bit of a conflict of interest. ‘Reinforced’… blah blah – stop changing your justifications. His sad, furtive life is a result of that hegemony.
As for homophobia – what about using the phrase ‘rent-boy’ for a 23-yr old. Of the suggestion you wouldn’t want someone who is probably an adult bisexual hanging around the playground?
Cause all gays are paedo – duh! Have you both bought tickets to Winchester to burn him out yet? Looks like your big scoop isn’t exactly Sandline.
Yours,
Disgusted of Westminster
Come, come, Recess Monkey. It’s a bit late to come over all coy now, isn’t it? You’ve already frightened the horses or did you say “C-O-asterisk-K” on your Ma’s-out-Pa’s-out-let’s-talk-rude tape recording as well?
The fact is, as I’ve said elsewhere, this was a classic forced outing of the kind the NOTW revelled in thirty years ago. When Peter Tatchell did this kind of thing he attracted justifiable ire from all sides.
You have no idea what goes on inside the Oaten’s marriage. For all we know, after stepping down from the leadership campaign, he was going to take a deep breath throw himself on his wife’s mercy and try to reach some peace with himself and his family.
Maybe yes, maybe no, but that choice has been taken away from him now, hasn’t it?
And let me get this straight, you out Oaten (although I, like others, have rather overstated your and Guido’s role in this – I suspect you’re the little kids at school picking up the big boy’s dog ends to look hard) and then castigate him for not being being a gay role model? You snigger about Oaten’s sexuality and tell him he’s not gay enough? What planet are you living on?
His resignation speech should have been, “I cannot tell a lie, I have a preference for cock” (there, I said it), should it? Has it not occured to you that he’d just had a national newspaper knock on his door and was probably in a bit of state? You can admit to that amount of human empathy at least, can’t you?
We’re now seeing an outpouring of the kind of gleeful homophobia that bubbles very close to the surface in this country. Is it any wonder some men still deny that they are gay – even to themselves – and then find themselves in this situation?
Do all gay men have that responsibility? Do gay firemen have to be out and proud to show that they can do their job just as well as their hetero colleagues?
Are you going to tell us where your cock’s been of late, Recess Monkey? I mean, without us knowing, how can we be sure you’re up to the job of spreading malicious gossip from behind the shield of anonymity?
No shield of anonymity for me and anyone who cares to find out who i am can do so through a 5 min google search or through emailing me. It’s probably on my own blog somewhere.
Anyone who does know me also knows I wear my sexuality on my sleeve – but that’s largely due to a shortage of kleenex. They also know that not one ounce of me is homophobic – indeed I often have to feign sexual ambiguity, and maybe wear pastel shades, just to tone down my sheer goddam masculinity, which would intimidate other men and cause women to swoon.
I’m not going to take criticism for moderating my language on someone else’s pages.
I have never pretended to be anything other than puerile and beavis-like. I have the occasional intellectual spasm and then I have to have a lie down.
If oaten had been banging two women of negotiable virtue, not much would have changed from my point of view – I’d still think he’s clammy, pallid and untrustworthy
And i never used the term rent boy.
Recess Monkey
*truly indignant*
http://www.recessmonkey.com
recessmonkey@gmail.com
Correct. You never used the term ‘rentboy’… but who spoke the words; “He does have the look of a paedo about him.”?
how many of you have six-figure readerships per month
Christ, what a cunt.
What’s the readership of The News of the World again?
That big?
Wow, it must be good.
I actually wouldn’t include you in the 7-readers-wannabe-an-Indy-leader-writer category. You’re far too good for that, but all these tedious high falutin’, high brow bores are not for me.
Seven readers? Like Nosemonkey and Tim Ireland? They all have seven readers?
I think they’d protest at that remark.
This post has been removed by the author.
“What Oaten did was wrong, yes.” ~ Justin
How do we know anything about the sexual politics of Oaten’s marriage? We don’t. Just because he was fucking some lad doesn’t mean that his wife didn’t know. In this climate of over willingness to pounce on anything which might be seen as even slightly ‘not normal’ and desparage it, she’d hardly have admitted it, would she? For all we know, she might have liked to watch and have a startling wardrobe and accessories… After all, she is a fucking adult!
What’s all this about gay? What do we know about his sexual preferences? It’s perfectly possible to play for both teams you know. Ah, but that’s even more unnacceptible and weird, eh? It’s not one thing or the other, it doesn’t fit conventional morality. No, he must be a red-blooded englishman shagging women, in which case he’s one of the lads, or a nasty little batty boy and we can hate him for it.
Still, after the coating Kennedy got, i couldn’t care less if Oaten is hounded by prejudice. You know what though:
“Ah Guido, we are all in the gutter, but some of us are looking at Mark Oaten’s arse.”
That’s pathetic. You might well be looking at Mark Oaten’s arse, but i’d suggest you are also denying that the stars exist. Then again, if arse is what you’re seeing, you could equally well be looking in a mirror.
I quite agree Justin, it’s not just homophobic, it’s disproportionate and strange… What’s happened to political correctness? Normally it’s in the way of normal conversations with uptight tree-huggers, but in this situation it seems to be sorely needed and not here!
That’s pathetic. You might well be looking at Mark Oaten’s arse, but i’d suggest you are also denying that the stars exist. Then again, if arse is what you’re seeing, you could equally well be looking in a mirror.
Well that’s just bloody marvellous, isn’t it? You know, I don’t write Chicken Yoghurt to be loved (although that would be nice) and I don’t write Chicken Yoghurt to be agreed with (although that’s nice as well).
But what I do write Chicken Yoghurt for is to be FUCKING UNDERSTOOD. Please edjog, will you explain to me how after reading the however many hundreds of words I have clearly wasted my time writing on this subject today you reached the conclusion that I in any way want to be looking at Mark Oaten’s arse rather than the stars? After my pathetic bleeding heart pleas for Oaten and his family to be left alone? My post-Catholic disgust at the salacious details that his children have may been exposed to? My naive calls for his colleagues to show him some compassion?
The comment you so wittily posit means I see an arse when I shave was made after Guido Fawkes said he blogged in the “gutter”. IT IS GUIDO FAWKES WHO IS LOOKING AT OATEN’S ARSE. IT IS GUIDO, I PROPOSE, WHO IS “DENYING THE STARS EXIST”.
Please, tell me, is there anybody else out there who got this far ( you have my thanks and sympathy) who thinks I have a prurient interest in Mark Oaten? Please, if my writing really is that opaque than tell me and I’ll pack it all in right now and go and write baffling jokes for Michael Barrymore. That way I’ll be performing a public service in consigning us both to oblivion.
And why can’t you go and speculate on Oaten’s sexuality on somebody’s else’s drum, Guido’s for instance? Or was I again not clear enough in my opinion that it was nobody else’s business but his and his wife’s? I don’t care if he’s gay, straight, bi or got 16 dicks. It’s none of anybody else’s business.
I liked this as well: i couldn’t care less if Oaten is hounded by prejudice. You’ve got a real big heart, haven’t you? The brotherhood of man really was just a band to you despite your salt of the earth self-stylings. Do you really think that any prejudice against Oaten exists in a vacuum or we have a more discerning breed of homophobe these days?
Earlier on today I remembered something I heard Guido say on Radio Five Live a couple of weeks ago during an interview about his then-upcoming podcast. In the interview he discussed his dislike of the more po-faced blogs, just as he has done in this comments thread. When I first heard the interview, I kind of thought he had a point.
Now I think, if I wanted to hear a couple of drunkards making stupid jokes about homosexuality (which, funnily enough, I don’t), I’d hang with the 12-year-olds outside Spar.
Oh, and another thing I remember Guido saying in the Five Live interview was that he was finding it extremely difficult to come up with enough funny material. A couple of weeks later, and that’s all-too-evident to the rest of us.
I sit corrected Justin. I confess that i got bored after a bit and skim read the rest of the comments, not realising it was you who had made the ‘Oaten’s arse’ remark. I am a dick. Had i done so it would have been clear to me that you were, in fact as you say, implying it was Guido Fawkes who is the arseologist. Having belatedly understood, i agree:
Guido Fawkes, as well as a star denying arseologist, you are also simply an arse.
I did like “drum”! As you suggest, i’ll be off to cane Guido’s momentarily. Far from the salt, i’m afraid: the scum, more likely to be levelled at me and believed, even by myself at times. I think it’s plain that i do care about prejudice, if by nothing else than my prior objection to your bald statement that what Oaten did was “wrong”, but in this particular instance it seems a bit like a case of
“Live by the sword, die by the sword.”
Fruity Oatens should be pleased: now people have heard of him…
DK
An odd and puzzling development (my arse): i did as you suggested, Justin. Caned Guido’s drum, but rather than any “gutter” style response, or, heaven forfend, attempts to address my accusation of proselytising prejudice, this self-defined disapprover of the “high brow” immediately resorted to claiming intellectual superiority!
My gloating but witty and, perhaps surprisingly for me, non profane, reply was deleted! The full story’s on DLA: Guido Fawkes is a spineless shitbag; should anyone object to driving his hit counter further up his raison d’etre.
We should leave the last word with the great harry hutton …
“Having testicles is like being chained to the village idiot. Sad, but there it is. And when we have solved every racial, political and economic problem, we will still be stuck with that one.”
I don’t think the problem is “homophobia”. If the rumoured act had involved females he’d still have been in deep trouble.
What I had against him were his idiotic political views – if he was on the right re law and order then God knows what the left is like.
I did find the story amusing though – despite reminding myself about how his wife, kids and self must be feeling now.