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	<title>Comments on: David Davis: premature capitulation?</title>
	<atom:link href="http://www.chickyog.net/2008/06/12/david-davis-premature-capitulation/feed/" rel="self" type="application/rss+xml" />
	<link>http://www.chickyog.net/2008/06/12/david-davis-premature-capitulation/</link>
	<description>The weblog of Brighton-based writer Justin McKeating</description>
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		<title>By: Dunc</title>
		<link>http://www.chickyog.net/2008/06/12/david-davis-premature-capitulation/comment-page-1/#comment-40017</link>
		<dc:creator>Dunc</dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Fri, 13 Jun 2008 13:37:02 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid isPermaLink="false">http://www.chickyog.net/?p=2535#comment-40017</guid>
		<description>&lt;i&gt;He has called for the return of the death penalty, backed section 28, and wants to scrap the Human Rights Act.&lt;/i&gt;

Oh, thank God for that! For a minute there, I was close to experiencing the unprecedented sensation of respecting a Tory, and for his principles. That was weird, to say the least...</description>
		<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p><i>He has called for the return of the death penalty, backed section 28, and wants to scrap the Human Rights Act.</i></p>
<p>Oh, thank God for that! For a minute there, I was close to experiencing the unprecedented sensation of respecting a Tory, and for his principles. That was weird, to say the least&#8230;</p>
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		<title>By: redpesto</title>
		<link>http://www.chickyog.net/2008/06/12/david-davis-premature-capitulation/comment-page-1/#comment-40015</link>
		<dc:creator>redpesto</dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Fri, 13 Jun 2008 12:46:15 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid isPermaLink="false">http://www.chickyog.net/?p=2535#comment-40015</guid>
		<description>Jeez...Davis v McKenzie - who do you most want to lose in that fight? (Even if you do oppose 42 days)

PS: Any chance of Rowan Williams coming out against 42 days on the grounds that even Jesus only had 40 days in the wilderness, with perhaps only Satan for company?</description>
		<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>Jeez&#8230;Davis v McKenzie &#8211; who do you most want to lose in that fight? (Even if you do oppose 42 days)</p>
<p>PS: Any chance of Rowan Williams coming out against 42 days on the grounds that even Jesus only had 40 days in the wilderness, with perhaps only Satan for company?</p>
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		<title>By: Dave Hansell</title>
		<link>http://www.chickyog.net/2008/06/12/david-davis-premature-capitulation/comment-page-1/#comment-40013</link>
		<dc:creator>Dave Hansell</dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Fri, 13 Jun 2008 12:36:32 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid isPermaLink="false">http://www.chickyog.net/?p=2535#comment-40013</guid>
		<description>Justin,

DD may well have an inconsistent record on these issues and I can see where you are coming from on this - particularly with the updates.

However, I&#039;m reminded of an incident related to me by a former Exec. member of the old CP that I know.

Years back he was involved in organising an anti-aparthied rally/demo.  All the usual Peoples Front of Judea/Judean Peoples front groups were there when this guy turns up, on his own, who explained he genuinlly felt aparthied was abohrrant - despite the fact that he was a Conservative supporter.

Well there was uproar.  No way say the PFoJ/JPF groups.  We ar&#039;nt having a Tory on &quot;our&quot; march.  At which point they had to be reminded as to the purpose of the event by my friend.  If this guy felt so strongly about aparthied and other people attending were genuine in practicing, as compared to preaching, anti-aparthied principles, they should have no problem having this guy on the march.

The point being that the situation is what it is now.  The by-election will go ahead.  DD may well be the main actor in this drama but he is not in control of events.  Currently, the Westminster village and their journo hacks are busy closing ranks and tut-tutting that someone has broken ranks.  The issue is what it is not what they or someone else wants it to be.

And that issue is the wider one of civil liberties.  The space which has opened up needs to be occupied - and quickly before the Westminster village and political class park their tanks on the lawn to frame the debate and issues their way.  

The alternative is that Murdoch&#039;s ego(who seems to be in favour of 420 rather than 42 days) wins the by-election at which point the argument and debate is also lost. 

Like the anti-aparthied example above, we have too much to lose to let this ground be occupied and won by the authoritarians of all parties.

Regards.

Dave Hansell
Stocksbridge
Sheffield</description>
		<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>Justin,</p>
<p>DD may well have an inconsistent record on these issues and I can see where you are coming from on this &#8211; particularly with the updates.</p>
<p>However, I&#8217;m reminded of an incident related to me by a former Exec. member of the old CP that I know.</p>
<p>Years back he was involved in organising an anti-aparthied rally/demo.  All the usual Peoples Front of Judea/Judean Peoples front groups were there when this guy turns up, on his own, who explained he genuinlly felt aparthied was abohrrant &#8211; despite the fact that he was a Conservative supporter.</p>
<p>Well there was uproar.  No way say the PFoJ/JPF groups.  We ar&#8217;nt having a Tory on &#8220;our&#8221; march.  At which point they had to be reminded as to the purpose of the event by my friend.  If this guy felt so strongly about aparthied and other people attending were genuine in practicing, as compared to preaching, anti-aparthied principles, they should have no problem having this guy on the march.</p>
<p>The point being that the situation is what it is now.  The by-election will go ahead.  DD may well be the main actor in this drama but he is not in control of events.  Currently, the Westminster village and their journo hacks are busy closing ranks and tut-tutting that someone has broken ranks.  The issue is what it is not what they or someone else wants it to be.</p>
<p>And that issue is the wider one of civil liberties.  The space which has opened up needs to be occupied &#8211; and quickly before the Westminster village and political class park their tanks on the lawn to frame the debate and issues their way.  </p>
<p>The alternative is that Murdoch&#8217;s ego(who seems to be in favour of 420 rather than 42 days) wins the by-election at which point the argument and debate is also lost. </p>
<p>Like the anti-aparthied example above, we have too much to lose to let this ground be occupied and won by the authoritarians of all parties.</p>
<p>Regards.</p>
<p>Dave Hansell<br />
Stocksbridge<br />
Sheffield</p>
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		<title>By: Charlie</title>
		<link>http://www.chickyog.net/2008/06/12/david-davis-premature-capitulation/comment-page-1/#comment-40011</link>
		<dc:creator>Charlie</dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Fri, 13 Jun 2008 11:40:13 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid isPermaLink="false">http://www.chickyog.net/?p=2535#comment-40011</guid>
		<description>If the MacKenzie / Murdoch &quot;Britain says YES to unlimited detention without trial&quot; campaign wins, they will have achieved what the BUF failed to achieve: some momentum. MacKenzie will be relying on the fact that every casual racist in Britain &#039;knows&#039; that the police only ever detain brown people (and nonces) and so feels completely comfortable faced with the prospect of a &#039;crack-down&#039;. This is dog whistle politics of the nastiest kind.

Other people have pointed out that Davis has also (inadvertently) exposed the unspoken ethos of the professional political class: namely, this isn&#039;t about the proles, or rights, or anything beyond being in government.

There are some very good reasons to support Davis in this, despite his various earlier pratfalls and inconsistencies.</description>
		<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>If the MacKenzie / Murdoch &#8220;Britain says YES to unlimited detention without trial&#8221; campaign wins, they will have achieved what the BUF failed to achieve: some momentum. MacKenzie will be relying on the fact that every casual racist in Britain &#8216;knows&#8217; that the police only ever detain brown people (and nonces) and so feels completely comfortable faced with the prospect of a &#8216;crack-down&#8217;. This is dog whistle politics of the nastiest kind.</p>
<p>Other people have pointed out that Davis has also (inadvertently) exposed the unspoken ethos of the professional political class: namely, this isn&#8217;t about the proles, or rights, or anything beyond being in government.</p>
<p>There are some very good reasons to support Davis in this, despite his various earlier pratfalls and inconsistencies.</p>
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		<title>By: Tim Ireland</title>
		<link>http://www.chickyog.net/2008/06/12/david-davis-premature-capitulation/comment-page-1/#comment-40007</link>
		<dc:creator>Tim Ireland</dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Fri, 13 Jun 2008 08:25:13 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid isPermaLink="false">http://www.chickyog.net/?p=2535#comment-40007</guid>
		<description>&quot;I’m as shocked as anyone. I didn’t see it coming at all…&quot;

Perhaps he should look over his shoulder more often.

[/would have said it even if Iain was a breeder]

[/applies equally to Cameron]

Tim Ireland&#039;s latest blog post... &lt;a href=&quot;http://www.bloggerheads.com/archives/2008/06/david_davis.asp&quot; rel=&quot;nofollow&quot;&gt;David Davis&lt;/a&gt;</description>
		<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>&#8220;I’m as shocked as anyone. I didn’t see it coming at all…&#8221;</p>
<p>Perhaps he should look over his shoulder more often.</p>
<p>[/would have said it even if Iain was a breeder]</p>
<p>[/applies equally to Cameron]</p>
<p>Tim Ireland&#8217;s latest blog post&#8230; <a href="http://www.bloggerheads.com/archives/2008/06/david_davis.asp">David Davis</a></p>
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		<title>By: Justin</title>
		<link>http://www.chickyog.net/2008/06/12/david-davis-premature-capitulation/comment-page-1/#comment-40006</link>
		<dc:creator>Justin</dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Fri, 13 Jun 2008 07:56:39 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid isPermaLink="false">http://www.chickyog.net/?p=2535#comment-40006</guid>
		<description>I hadn&#039;t seen it - I&#039;ve sworn off Dale for a bit and feeling much better for it, thanks. So, it turns out he&#039;s no better informed than the rest of us. There&#039;s a surprise.</description>
		<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>I hadn&#8217;t seen it &#8211; I&#8217;ve sworn off Dale for a bit and feeling much better for it, thanks. So, it turns out he&#8217;s no better informed than the rest of us. There&#8217;s a surprise.</p>
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		<title>By: Nosemonkey</title>
		<link>http://www.chickyog.net/2008/06/12/david-davis-premature-capitulation/comment-page-1/#comment-40005</link>
		<dc:creator>Nosemonkey</dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Fri, 13 Jun 2008 07:47:49 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid isPermaLink="false">http://www.chickyog.net/?p=2535#comment-40005</guid>
		<description>I&#039;m moderately surprised you haven&#039;t noted the reaction of &quot;Westminster insider&quot; Iain Dale. &lt;a href=&quot;http://news.bbc.co.uk/1/hi/uk_politics/7450683.stm&quot; rel=&quot;nofollow&quot;&gt;I quote&lt;/a&gt;: &quot;I&#039;m as shocked as anyone. I didn&#039;t see it coming at all...&quot;

Surely as the former leadership campaign manager of the Rt Hon David Davis MP, Dale&#039;s the political commentator in the best possible position to get a scoop? So why didn&#039;t he? If even his ex-boss won&#039;t bung him a bone, who in Westminster is?

Yep - challenging the mainstream media hard and fast here in blogland...</description>
		<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>I&#8217;m moderately surprised you haven&#8217;t noted the reaction of &#8220;Westminster insider&#8221; Iain Dale. <a href="http://news.bbc.co.uk/1/hi/uk_politics/7450683.stm">I quote</a>: &#8220;I&#8217;m as shocked as anyone. I didn&#8217;t see it coming at all&#8230;&#8221;</p>
<p>Surely as the former leadership campaign manager of the Rt Hon David Davis MP, Dale&#8217;s the political commentator in the best possible position to get a scoop? So why didn&#8217;t he? If even his ex-boss won&#8217;t bung him a bone, who in Westminster is?</p>
<p>Yep &#8211; challenging the mainstream media hard and fast here in blogland&#8230;</p>
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		<title>By: Dave Hansell</title>
		<link>http://www.chickyog.net/2008/06/12/david-davis-premature-capitulation/comment-page-1/#comment-40004</link>
		<dc:creator>Dave Hansell</dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Fri, 13 Jun 2008 06:35:14 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid isPermaLink="false">http://www.chickyog.net/?p=2535#comment-40004</guid>
		<description>This mornings Radio 4 were reporting ex Sun Editor Kelvin Mackenzie may be standing against him.

No doubts there about whose ego Kelvin will be representing.</description>
		<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>This mornings Radio 4 were reporting ex Sun Editor Kelvin Mackenzie may be standing against him.</p>
<p>No doubts there about whose ego Kelvin will be representing.</p>
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		<title>By: Jim Bliss</title>
		<link>http://www.chickyog.net/2008/06/12/david-davis-premature-capitulation/comment-page-1/#comment-40003</link>
		<dc:creator>Jim Bliss</dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Thu, 12 Jun 2008 23:21:07 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid isPermaLink="false">http://www.chickyog.net/?p=2535#comment-40003</guid>
		<description>&lt;i&gt;Call me naive, but I honestly do believe that Davis’s “point of principle” is genuine.&lt;/i&gt;

You&#039;re naive.

(sorry, couldn&#039;t resist).

Jim Bliss&#039;s latest blog post... &lt;a href=&quot;http://numero57.net/?p=285&quot; rel=&quot;nofollow&quot;&gt;Referendum Day&lt;/a&gt;</description>
		<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p><i>Call me naive, but I honestly do believe that Davis’s “point of principle” is genuine.</i></p>
<p>You&#8217;re naive.</p>
<p>(sorry, couldn&#8217;t resist).</p>
<p>Jim Bliss&#8217;s latest blog post&#8230; <a href="http://numero57.net/?p=285">Referendum Day</a></p>
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		<title>By: Lobster Blogster</title>
		<link>http://www.chickyog.net/2008/06/12/david-davis-premature-capitulation/comment-page-1/#comment-40002</link>
		<dc:creator>Lobster Blogster</dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Thu, 12 Jun 2008 23:04:14 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid isPermaLink="false">http://www.chickyog.net/?p=2535#comment-40002</guid>
		<description>Yes, he surely must be a man of principle.

Here&#039;s a list of 72 written questions he asked about the number of Christmas cards sent out by each government department.

http://www.theyworkforyou.com/search/?s=section%3Awrans+christmas+speaker%3A10162+

It&#039;s one step from there to Magna Carta.</description>
		<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>Yes, he surely must be a man of principle.</p>
<p>Here&#8217;s a list of 72 written questions he asked about the number of Christmas cards sent out by each government department.</p>
<p><a href="http://www.theyworkforyou.com/search/?s=section%3Awrans+christmas+speaker%3A10162+">http://www.theyworkforyou.com/search/?s=section%3Awrans+christmas+speaker%3A10162+</a></p>
<p>It&#8217;s one step from there to Magna Carta.</p>
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